The End is Nigh for Chelsea Liverpool Man Utd Arsenal
The End is Nigh title is a bit strong and obviously the title does not mean the End of the Top 4 clubs, just their hold on the Top 4 places of the Premier League.
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I was reading this article in Forbes.com this morning, and found it reassuring that when it comes to home-grown players than West Ham lead the way, and by 2013-14 West Ham will have a possibility of leapfrogging its way into a Big 4 Club.
research by BBC Sport shows the number of England-eligible players who are starting each week in the
Premier League fell last season to 170, its lowest level since the first season of the competition.
That year, there were 207, and despite a recent upward trend until last season, the number has not come close to that level since.
Meanwhile, FIFA, the sport’s world governing body, looks set this week to revive plans to introduce a “quota” of homegrown players in order to preserve some semblance of national identity and prevent richer clubs from simply assembling an array of high-priced global talent that inevitably squeezes out young domestic players.
The BBC’s research shows that Arsenal–which finished third in the Premiership last season–had by far the fewest English players in its regular starting 11. In fact, it averaged out that it had used less than half of one English player per game.
At the other end of the spectrum, West Ham had the most England-eligible players in its regular starting 11, with an average of just over six and a half per game. West Ham, though, finished 10th.
So is the argument that there are not enough English players, or just not enough good English players? Perhaps it’s the same argument.
The Premier League, unsurprisingly, played down the correlation, reminding the BBC that ” … in the 70s and 80s the vast majority of players in the top flight were eligible for England, yet we routinely struggled to qualify for tournaments, let alone perform in them.” And the League argues that a quota rule could simply create a bigger pool of “average,” homegrown players.
But a recent report by the Professional Footballers Association–the players’ union–calls the current scenario nothing less than a “meltdown” and says the decline in the development of English talent needs to be urgently addressed.
“We have become a finishing school for the rest of the world,” the report says, “at the expense of our own players.”
FIFA President Sepp Blatter’s idea would–eventually–limit the number of foreign players in each team’s starting 11 to five. He wants the proposed “six-plus-five” rule to be gradually adopted by 2012 but acknowledges that the plan will need the cooperation of both European football’s governing body, UEFA, and the European Union, which has employment laws in place protecting the free movement of labor.
Undeterred, though, Blatter makes the point that the Manchester United team, which won the dramatic Champions League final last week had, in fact, six starters who were eligible to play for England.
West Ham have always prided its Academy on brining in some of the Worlds elite players, and with Sears, Tomkins, Collison, Spence, Junior, all coming through the ranks, than i have to admit, The Future for West Ham looks bright.
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May 28th, 2008 at 9:39 AM
Interesting topic.But is it not feesable that West Ham will sell the quality English players they have by 2012 to the Big 4 clubs, as they have done many times in the past? as will most of the other clubs in the little 16?
May 28th, 2008 at 9:42 AM
This was interesting in its niavity. So West Ham produce all these super stars then sell them to others? Then produce more so they average 6.5 eligible for UK players so they can finish where every year?Sorry mate but 20 years before foreign players became the norm (and think that will gradually end over the next ten years anyway) West Ham were a disgrace to their supprters with their money grabbing sales to Spurs and Manure. A sad point of fact is that the only reason kids sign for WH is because they know they will be sold on to proper clubs later.Even worse it must be galling to know what might have been if their board had kept just a few players for a few more years.
May 28th, 2008 at 9:47 AM
You so obviously dont know about our academy. Arsenal have produced more England players full and under 21’s in the past 10 years than either Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or West Ham.It isnt our fault we find better players (foreign) or that English footballers cant hang around long enough (Bentley) to get into the team; come to think about it the last player we flogged West Ham was a Swede (is that not foreign). Sepp Blatter is talking out of his backside. We are in Europe and you cant deny a foreign footballer his trade by playing here. It’s like saying we should have only let in 1,000 Poles instead of the 100,000 that did arrive as it would let them take jobs away from the English.The English have been shite at football since 1970, so blame the schools for not being competitive or the FA for not opening academies sooner……but stop blaming The Arsenal!!!!!!!!!!
May 28th, 2008 at 9:47 AM
yes but don’t you think that the quota will actually be to the detriment of your club too. you ask why? i tell you why. where do you think the top 4 will get their english players from once the quota come into effect ( it won’t but for the sake or argument say it does) that right from the likes of west ham and boro.all those youngsters you’ve mentioned will be on their way to old trafford,the emirates,anfield and the bridge.the reason the top 4 is the top 4 is not because they have more foreign players, it is because they have better players ( and managers)
May 28th, 2008 at 9:49 AM
Great article which is pretty well informed. The only thing it doesn’t cater to are EU employment laws which prevent players from EU countries (or holding EU passports…) from playing in other EU countries. We’re already seeing the fruits of this - players from South America being bought by Premiership clubs and farmed out to Spain until they have their EU passport and can play here without a work permit. Carlos Vela is the latest example.Whatever ‘quotas’ Blatter puts in place will never negotiate EU trade laws without compromising them - something that will never be allowed. Clubs like Arsenal, Man Utd, Chelsea with ties to clubs in countries with trade ties outside the EU (Belgium - former African / Asian colonies, France - the same, Spain - former S American colonies) will continue to play the EU passport game same as they are now.It is an inevitability and in order to compete clubs like West Ham need to forge similar ties.
May 28th, 2008 at 9:59 AM
I agree with you Frank and the proof is in the pudding when you look at the guys who play and win for the England u19’s, and the days of West Ham selling off its young Brits are hopefully over.
The future of the Premier League will be a little fairer and also interesting.
Its also good to see some mature comments from the other fans.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:08 AM
Always respected west ham and its academy. Good luck in the future. Still I believe the future of England is at Arsenal with Walcott and Randall.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:18 AM
Arsenal cannot get around the fact that they are bottom of the table in playing english players. Arsenal have not produced more england and england u21 than West Ham. Currently at U21 you have Anton Ferdinand and Mark Noble. Full england team you have Ferdinand, Lampard, Glen Johnson, John Terry (sort of), Michael Carrick, Jermain Defoe and Joe Cole. If you want to go back in time you have Moore, Peters, Hurst, Banks it just makes me laugh when Arsenal think that they have produced more than West Ham…Keown, Seaman and Adams? Arsenal would win an award for the most french players. Freddie Sears is the next one (scored 2 goals in England’s 2-0 win over Poland at England U19 level). I would rather win nothing at West Ham with the principles it has (bringing through and buying english players) than win titles at Chelsea, Man U and Liverpool where success is literally brought…where is the fun in that? Simple..who ever has the most money gets the best players. At least Arsenal bring through their players (Cesc, Toure, Clichy etc) though being foreign they nuture them themselves.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:20 AM
I have to admit when Chelsea had Mourinho, i admired him because of the way he picked his team to please his fans with a good bunch of English players, and i still say it was a big loss to Chelsea to lose him, and a big loss to England for not signing him as Coach.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:34 AM
I am an Arsenal fan so my response may seem obvious, but Sue above is right. We have produced a lot of quality home grown players and are producing even more. The next batch will have many more that make it to the first team in the next few years. At the moment they are not quite ready and the other good English players out there are so few that their prices are stupid. Top internationals development starts from a young age and the top tier cannot be expected to develop all players from this age. You have to track back down through the league to the non league and look at the teams that are local to each of the EPL clubs. If you have proper development from the bottom up then these players are consistently taken on to the next bigger local club already technically sound at each stage. Then when AW recruits players for the acadamy he doesn’t need to look abroad as the players he needs are right on his doorstep. This doesn’t happen and he shouldn’t have to recruit inferior players because they are English or pay silly money because there are so few good ones. The continental system develops players far more technically from a young age so when the likes of Barca recruit them in their mid teens they are already technically of the highest standard for that age group. This is why I disagree with the quota in England as it dodges the harder issue of grass roots development and is an easy bandwagon to jump on. I feel it is a kind of bury your heads in the sand to find an easy explanation for our failings rather than look at the harder but more relevant one. The other problem is that if a quota is pushed through the top four will just go on a one season spending blitz to snap up the few good English players. It may set Arsenal back initially but with our turnover we would recover. Most other clubs can’t do this and would end up with the lesser players. If you think the gap between the top four and the rest is big now wait till you see it with this quota, and I am saying this as a fan of one of the clubs that would likely be ok in this situation.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:38 AM
This is the only stick that people get to beat Arsenal with - their lack of English players.The Premier League is not a competition to see who can play the most English players, it’s to see who can win the most games. Arsenal came third in that competition.The fact of the matter is that transfer fees for English players is significantly higher because no one wants to sell to their closest rivals.Arsene Wenger (and he’s not alone) go to the continent because he can pick up players of the same, if not greater, quality for a fraction of the price. This is not Arsenals fault it’s the fault of teams like Chelsea, West Ham, et al who are either paying or demanding over-inflated prices for their English ‘talent’.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:41 AM
james england has yet to do anything on internatioanl level in thirty years. could it be the west ham academy has not prepared those international that you so proudly mentioned well for the big tournament. you say that whoever has the most money get the best player. what makes you think that will change without the foreign players. did you read my point about the effect this ruling is likely to have on your club. beleive west ham will be worse of if this stupid rule comes into effect.
May 28th, 2008 at 10:43 AM
James if you want to go back in time to those years then you are avoiding the point. The point being that The Arsenal NOW produce more England internationals that the likes of West Ham….full stop game over. I really cant put it any plainer than that. Did you go to school to learn how to be stupid or does it come naturally.Look at what I typed earlier you jerk…..and your response is “Arsenal cannot get around the fact that they are bottom of the table in playing english” Well I would rather be hanging around the bottom of that list and playing beautiful football than being relegated every now and then!!!
May 28th, 2008 at 11:06 AM
Just seen comments from James above. Yes West Ham should be applauded for their past acadamy development and its current impact on the national team. I am not sure if you are still bringing players of the same calibre through but I will wait and see over the next few years. I feel Arsenals current acadamy crop will have a big and similar impact in years to come on the national team. Again we will have to wait and see.With reference to Red Cafe and also to comments a while back by Sir Alex Ferguson, both Chelsea and Utd seem to take a moral high ground with this playing the English player thing, but largely the reality of the situation is that they have financially been able to blow all other clubs out of the way to secure these players. Admittedly Utd produced their golden generation of Scoles, Beckham e.t.c but what good English players have come through the Utd acadamy since. The good English players at Utd were all developed elsewhere and bought for huge fees so Sir Alex cannot claim to be the saviour of English football. It is similar at Chelsea, although I do not know too much about their acadamy players coming through. I believe we were in for Wright Phillips when he was due to leave Man City and I think we were looking at a reasonable £11m. How can you compete with a club that then offers an unrealistic £22m which is way above what they would offer if they were running the club on its genuine finances. So I can’t quite buy into the admiration of Chelsea or Utd on this issue. I still have far more respect for West Ham and their past acadamy graduates and I think and hope that Arsenal are trying to emulate that in some way now.
May 28th, 2008 at 11:07 AM
another aspect which many are not taking into account is the monetary.should the likes of cristiano ronaldo,drogba,cesc,torres etc you can be sure that the global fascination with the prem with decrease. afterall many asians fan went to watch man utd just to see becks.Reduce viewership also means reduce television fees which will have a direct impact on all club in the prem. particularly the smaller club which now earn a lot of money on the back of the likes of arsenal,man utd international popularity.
May 28th, 2008 at 12:00 PM
I apologise to any Arsenal fans i have annoyed. I just do not feel West Ham get credit for what they have done. 6 million for Joe Cole not really a fair price. West Ham were forced to sell players when they were relegated due to the club facing financial ruin. Man United are threating to sue Real Madrid over the Ronaldo debacle when they do exactly the same! They unsettle players, Wayne Rooney and Michael Carrick for instance. They epitomise hypocracy. I have a great deal of admiration for Arsenal and the way they play football. If i were a fan i would rather have come third playing beautiful football and running on a low budget using players that cost almost nothing than be champions (by a small margin) but having broought success. I hope relations between West Ham and Arsenal remain good as i admire both clubs principals and look forward to seeing Arsenal youngters like Gibson ? coming through the ranks. Thanks
May 28th, 2008 at 1:01 PM
I hope times change soon, it’s what the game needs. In regards to the Arsenal debate Sue, the we’ve done better than your club and so on as no relevance on if we have any own grown talent at West ham for England, because Noble is coming through ok and so will Sears. As for others at the hammers time will tell. As for Arsenal, I don’t have a problem with them, they play smooth football and have kept themselves in the top four, so good luck to them.
May 28th, 2008 at 1:03 PM
Sue, instead of spouting that Arsenal have produced more home-grown players in the last ten years that have played for England and England U21. Why don’t you name them? West Ham fans can easily name the players that have played for England, why can’t you? And before you say the name Walcott, please don’t claim that you produced him. You bought him when he had already played nearly a full season with Southampton. So apart from Bentley and Hoyte, who exactly are these players? Seaman was bought, Dixon, Keown, Bould, Wright, were all bought. Name them before you talk crap on someone elses website. I think you will find that is GAME OVER, END OF CONVERSATION. Arsenal are the future of French and African football, they have noting to do with the future of English football.
May 28th, 2008 at 1:08 PM
Oh and for your information the freedom of movement act only applies to EU footballers. Most of the African players you have can easily be stopped from playing in England. Thats why most other EU nations have a limit on non-EU players. They do because its perfectly legal to do it.
May 28th, 2008 at 1:12 PM
Sue, I’m having a bit of trouble coming to terms with your boast about the arse producing more full England internationals over the last 10 years. Can you name the players because I believe that if this boast is true I think it’s more of a case that the arse have provided rather than produced. Players such as Wright, Seaman, Dixon, Campbell and even Walcott (to name a few) did/have not come through the arse system but are products of other clubs.On another note I find it amusing how defensive gooners get when confronted with the truth. The truth is that wenger has a ‘poor’ record of fielding home grown players. The truth is that wenger is constantly linked with foreign players. The truth is that gooners are trying to convince non-gooners that it’s how the football’s played and the amount spent rather than silverware won. The truth is that gooners become defensive simply because the truth hurts
May 28th, 2008 at 1:17 PM
For goodness sake James get a spine. A few people criticise your previous posting and you quickly reply with your tail between your legs. Oh the Hackney Hammers would be proud
May 28th, 2008 at 1:19 PM
Hmmm, apparently Fifa wants to take on the EU laws. There is no way that a quota would be created to restrict foreign players…it’s just not possible.
May 28th, 2008 at 1:36 PM
Steve..i was merely trying to keep good relations with Arsenal. I like their football but disagree witht eh amount of foreigners produced end of. Hammers should stick together…Deano to start tonight IRONS…IRONS
May 28th, 2008 at 3:25 PM
as i am not english i could care less about the english national team. i do not get defensive about this issue. the funny things is that people like steve and istanbulhammer have not dare take up the point i raise ealier about the ruling actually being detrimental to west ham and the likes because deep down they must realized it true.
May 28th, 2008 at 5:18 PM
The only thing enki that is true is that sooner or later the game is going to change for the better. Other clubs have new owners and with the debt issue being raised by Platini and the rise in other clubs, West Ham being one of them in the future, there is hope that our beloved game stops being monotonous at the top, with other teams having a challenge. Obviously those at the top will always be up there, but the thought of having other clubs rocking the boat whenever possible is a breath of fresh air.
May 28th, 2008 at 7:38 PM
as a wh fan i look forward to the future, especially the nxt few years when we can (hopefully) establish a squad capable of uefa cup and then more. I also have no problem with arsenal and the fact they play mostly foreign players because if you see their acadamy coming thru, you’ll see alot more english talent breakin into their first team. The acadamy is filled with young english kids plying fooballjust like the arsenal first team does, how AW likes them to so when they get to the riht age they will easily be able to keep up with the current talent. I no i’ve been sayin far too much about arsenal but as i said i don’t mind arsenal because i see they are doing this…its better for the england national team….and they hates yids aswell, who btw i don;t see producin anything…but i might just be biased…COYI
May 29th, 2008 at 9:15 AM
English players are over-rated whoever they play for with the exception of a handful. What have England won or likely to win. Yes they play without gloves and are hard in the tackle but that game has gone. Technical ability is what matters now - which is why the French and Italians always do so well. As far as the Prem league is concerned - there are only 2 real teams now and this is set to continue. Modern day footballers care about money - which means the best players will always join Chelsea, Man Utd, Inter, AC, Barca and Real Madrid. Im West Ham and love the way Arsenal play - but your big players are quoting not winning the league or getting close to Champions League success as a way out. The fact is players like Flamini double/triple their wages when they leave - AC are in the UEFA Cup so it isnt anything to do with winning Serie A or honours as they dont come close - they are the Liverpool or Italy. Players such as Hleb, Adebayour, Van Persie, will all follow Flamini if Arsenal dont change the wage structure. Spurs missed out on Petrov due to wages but seem to have taken that on board and need to pay wages or lose their stars - Berbatov springs to mind - I dont believe he wants CL footie - I believe he wants to double his wages - its the same in life - money goes to money and the rich get the best toys. Abrahamovic is the ultimate example.
May 29th, 2008 at 11:23 AM
FAO Sue and the other Gooners…
When I first saw these stats, I was PROUD that West Ham had the most English players.
Can you honestly say that you were ‘proud’ to be at the bottom of that statistic?
Arsenal play brilliant football, and I like the fact that Wenger doesn’t try and buy success like the other 3 ‘Top 4′.
But you must agree, it just cannot be right for an English football team to field an 11 of non-English players.
I’m not saying this to be high and mighty, it is just wrong.
You don’t need to try and justify Arsene’s policy, it doesn’t make you any less of a supporter to see something wrong in your team.
May 29th, 2008 at 4:25 PM
not being english ohmygosh i could care less.
May 30th, 2008 at 1:03 PM
there are two sides to football; the players and the fans/spectators. We abroad watch EPL because we have a stake in our national players featured, and we enjoy the full entertainment it offers. FIFA may as well make rules that will force fans to watch British players, or else EPL may well forget the growing fans abroad that spend much traveling and supporting their clubs. The future of football lies on the fans not nationality. After all what is globalisation all about.
May 30th, 2008 at 11:28 AM
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